Also, I might as well add that since the combat (in this form) is physics based and since physics engine allows me to adjust how fast time is flowing... the current plan is to slow time down a little during combat.  This will, I think, mitigate many of the "too hard to control" issues and allow fights to be more strategic.  It also means that a surprised player who is really on the ball might be able to parry the first blow... as soon as the other player goes to hit them a local time-slowing bubble is formed and both players will hear their own heartbeats or something.  So if the attackee is really on the ball he might be able to spin and parry a really slow attack or something.  Perhaps there is even magic that would allow you to detect attacks sooner and slow time sooner.  I think it's fair because both players would know it happened.

The interesting thing is that if the time distortion turns out not to be too big (or maybe even so) for spectators outside the bubble I can play the attacks in real time... just pause between to let time catch up.  And since there was a lot of control for the battlers, I think watching others fight could be really interesting for spectators.

There is potentially more I can do here after I see how it pans out.  For example, if both players have committed to their strike (started the drag of their long sword and just let it follow through) then time can be sped up again briefly until the blows connect.  Might end up being too disorienting... but it also might feel like living in your own matrix-style bullet-time battle.

That sounds amazing! though i doubt you'd get to that anytime soon. will you be putting an early, early simple version of combat up soon?

well i could probably deal with no sound, but i thought f6 only did screenshots?
and so i downloaded fraps. so i just push f9 to start recording in game? is f9 used for something else normally?

1. Is there a way to record me playing the game? I've never done it before but I figured this would be a good game to try.

2. Do I have to spawn in the same place every time? or is there a way to change that.

3. Is there really anything you can do in "game mode" right now?

Thanks in advance for helping

re: Flat of the blade to knock someone out, that's precisely the idea.

re: A thread on magic, a user named Sunjammer tried to consolidate various posts into one and there was some discussion here: http://mythruna.com/forum/index.php?topic=548.0

...there may be some scattered info elsewhere.  I've been pretty silent on combat since I'm not sure I can make it fun yet and I hate getting people excited about stuff that is iffy.  This is, I think, the most I've posted on it so far.

Glad i got the knocking out thing right. Hope to see updates soon! Looking forward to seeing how all these things come together.

P.S. i fully support trying to make the combat as fun and non-repetitive as possible.

Almost right... I only read through your description briefly but saw a difference early.

(Caveat: this is all based on current design and may be tweaked for playability once I actually get further along.)

All of the normal mouse buttons are used for the right hand actions.  For example, for a sword, left mouse will be slash and right will be stab, or something.  Middle mouse wheel for a sword might rotate object in your hand (so you can hit with the flat instead of the blade)... an action more useful for other types of objects but I think still useful for a sword maybe.

To control the object in your left hand, you'd hold the ctrl key.  So if you want to position your shield then you'd hold the ctrl key down and move the mouse.  If you want to attack while holding the shield then you have to release the ctrl key and then you can use your sword again.  This seems realistic to me since it requires real separation and I don't have to include any artificial "attacking is reduced while holding shield" since it's natural.

The bow I'm less sure about.  My current notes say that the left button alone will slash with the bow... maybe you want to bash someone's head in with it.  Holding both left and right buttons nocks an arrow and puts you in "draw" mode.  Pulling the mouse back will pull the bowstring.  Moving the mouse left or right will aim left or right.  My current notes say that if you pull the string back far enough then you fire automatically but you can also release the right button to set the drawn bow into "aim" mode where now mouse up, down, left, right will aim the bow.  Holding the right button again will change the draw again... and so on.  Releasing the left button will fire the arrow.  This scheme allows both rapid indiscriminate firing (hold both buttons, move mouse forward and back) as well as carefully aimed and powered firing.  (The bow "icon" in the lower left will indicate how far the bow is drawn.)  For example, a really good archer could get pretty precise I think... maybe there could even be some magic means of helping them aim, set power, account for wind, etc..

At least that's the design so far.

I love these ideas for the combat! You might be able to make it so that if you want to just knock an enemy or animal unconscious, you use something like the flat side of your sword to do so. In any case, brilliant! Its going to take some serious willpower in patience to wait for the magic and combat to be realeased. Is there a separate thread for combat ideas and magic ideas?

any quests is just another way mythruna will stand out of the crowd. good job! You sound like you have some big plans for the money system.

Sounds good and up to caliber. sooo... there will be a focus on quests

I'm just glad you actually tried reading lol i thought you were gonna look at it and say "not worth the time".

It's about balance.  If a human wants to use up all of their magic slots to become the equivalent of a reptilian (with all of the same negatives) then I don't see why that's a problem... now they have no more slots to do anything else.  Likewise, if you want to turn your human into an Avian equivalent... which probably takes at least two of your slots and now you can't carry heavy things anymore if you want to fly... I also don't see a problem with that.  Levitation magic will definitely be possible.  You might not have the wings but you will be able to "fly".

If there isn't this parity then it risks letting one race somehow dominate the others.

I have read your posts and see thats the way you want to go. but i think that doing this would make humans the "one race" who "somehow dominate the others". That first part you said, about using all their slots to be a reptilian equivalent, good and bad, i think that is the best way to balance it without making humans "overpowered". Just make sure that they can't just switch between all the races ( and their pros/cons) at will and still have magic slots to boost their abilities further.

Players will have control over their starting equipment and if I include a character back story then they will have control over that, too.  You will never start with a town charter.  That's like giving a warrior a +5 sword and +5 armor to start with.

the town thing was just an idea  but ok that sounds like a good idea. Im sure you'll balance the starting equipment well.

Dragons start out fully buried (deep) and made of stone.  Only players can awaken them by getting close enough that they magically activate them.  And yes, they will leave a crater or cave depending on how they choose to emerge.  It will be difficult to escape in time if you accidentally wake one up... I suspect most players to die if they wake a dragon.

No worries on the loot drops... they will be huge.  Within the mob rules of the game, I will make dragons unkillable.  Huge amount of hitpoints, automatic regeneration of hitpoints, heavy armor over most of their bodies, etc..  Even their eyes will be made of a hard crystal material that might be impervious to certain weapons.  They will not be impossible to kill in the "god mode" sense... there will be no script automatically resurrecting a dragon, for example.  So within that, it is theoretically possible to kill them but even I don't want to know exactly how.  Maybe you have to drop a mountain on them... maybe you have to mess with their support system (I don't want to give away anything there, though).

Sounds cool! my only comment is to make them extremely rare if they're as tough as i hope they'll be.

I've written so much on this already that I'm not sure I will get too far into it.  Mining will not be an important part of the game any more than hunting rabbits.

Crafting will be way way way more important.  Item crafting will be as flexible (from the engine's perspective) as the object blueprints but way more involved.  I think I've touched on this in other posts.

I haven't seen those posts and i don't have the time to dig through to find them, but ok I'll eagerly await your plans.

Current design: no skills, no training.  Your skills should be your own player skills.  Acquire better equipment to get better.

Everything else leads to the "kill 400 badgers" problem and that has far reaching implications.  "Kill 400 badgers" "make 400 swords"... they all ruin the game in about a dozen ways.  Crying player: "Making a sword takes too many steps.  How am I ever going to make 400 of them to achieve my uber-level?!?"  Crying player: "Why can I only sell my swords for a single coin when all of the merchants sell swords for 400 coins?"  and so on.

And tools/equipment can be bought/sold/traded/stolen... which I think might lead to some interesting game play that a mere "Woot! I'm level 40 in rabbit slaying!" wouldn't.

aha! but you're thinking of the classic skyrim "ok, I'll cast this weak Destruction spell for 2 hours for a level up!". the beauty of the system i suggested is their are many skills that really only require level ups on your characters side, meaning you shouldn't "grind" for levels, but rather you get experience by going out and playing the game! Hopefully the randomization of such a game would make grinding impractical. And after that, you can put points in skills and get better as you play the game, making your character well-earned. Maybe I'm going a little hardcore RPG on this (i get like that), so maybe that can be a hardcore rpg setting. But i digress, I do like your idea of the "bought/sold/traded/stolen" thing for items, that will be interesting indeed! And honestly, I'm not sure what you mean by "Your skills should be your own player skills." sounds to me like i can run out and get an uber-sword from the beginning.

that does sound cool, though "feathers" would also be prominant in avian headstyle, wouldn't you agree?

When you say "lizardman" or reptilian, I think of either Skyrim Argonians or the Lizardman from Soul Calibur 

[Cat Vision]

I imagine this is where this post should go, so here I go-
Since I found Mythruna and this site a few days ago, I've been consumed by thoughts on how the game might be or how i hope it will be. Not that if it's different i won't like it, mind you, but just thoughts on how *I* would go about the ideas already posed by Paul. I have been writing all my ideas in a journal under their categories, and have decided that there is enough (for now) to make at least one post of suggestions. Like I said, I only want to show Paul and the community my perspective on what he's been proposing, and you guys can yay or nay it however you like. Now lets hope I understood Paul correctly:

1. The Magic Slot concept:
My idea for this is that their should be 2 windows for equipping things- 1 for physical equipment like weapons and armor, the other for "magic essence" (ethereal (yet colorful) spheres of pure magic energy) slots, whereever they are on that races body, and you can press a button to switch the view between them (I picture a body of that race with slots where certain equipment or essence is supposed to go).
Humans, like Paul said, will have the most slots for magic due to their bodies taking their innovative nature. HOWEVER, I disagree that humans should be able to obtain the magical abilities other races have, ever, magic essence or otherwise. This is to make the other races truly unique and important, rather than to just pick a human every time, knowing you would get what the other races have in the end anyway. That means, if you want to fly, you pick Avian, because that is their unique trait and humans shouldn't get it. I made some examples of what i think some races should have as fixed traits, but there's only a few and they are only barely thought out. They are:
Cat Vision- Pantherians have an innate magic vision in low-to-no lighting. Pantherians can always see fairly clearly, be it in caves or in a forest at night.
Thick Bones- Dwarves' bones are magically enfused so they are extra hardy and strong. Dwarves fatigue slower than any other race, and are slightly stronger.
Magic Scales- Due to small amounts of Dragon blood in Reptilians, their scales are hard and may even turn away a sword. Gives a decent bonus to armor class.
These are just a few, but I hope you see what i was getting at. I have to think more about how the essence would be gained/found, though I'm sure Paul already has ideas on that. maybe in another post.
2.Races & Classes
OK, so I know Paul has shied away from the concept of classes, but please hear me out. I don't mean classes as the typical rogue, warrior, mage, etc., but rather where you are in life when you start the game, so its more like you starting profession. Note, however, that choosing one class doesn't alienate you from anything in the game, it just gives you starting options. My ideas for this are limited and probably imbalanced because I don't really know what all Paul has up his sleeve, but here's what I got:
Governor- You start as a small-time official of a nearby/home town. You have some beginning money, though not much, and/or have a town charter or town plot (http://mythruna.com/forum/index.php?topic=11.0)
Mercenary- You have lived your whole life by the sword, for it is your livelihood and salvation. Start the game with an ok weapon and 1 or 2 armor pieces. (maybe more to add to that class)
Miner- The mine is like a second home to you. You start with a pickaxe and a weak miner's helmet.
Though there is only 3, they can help propel you in the direction you were hoping to go.
3.Mobs & Dragons
The mobs part i will add in a later post, so for now its about dragons. This is a small section, just a few ideas i had thought of. I believe that dragons should be of different colors and do different things depending on color (though I'd be happy with just different looking dragons). The dragons should live deep underground or in mountains, and (this part is out there) possibly even a cutscene of some sort for the first dragon you awaken. If just deep underground, he should shoot up, leaving a crater to where he once was. If in a mountain, they just fly forward, out of the mountain. Drops from dragons should be very high level and very hard to obtain.
4.Overall Concept Balancing
Now this is where I really have been thinking about. This section covers overall gameplay mechanics and how to balance those mechanics into a multi-faceted game. First, I'd like to say that the building part of the game is great, but it should not be all or even most of what you do in the game. I'd give it *maybe* a third of the game, if that. It should be used to interact and move the world around you and to allow you to create and build the homes and objects of your dreams, but thats about it (in the RPG mode, at least). The other 2 thirds should be given to these 2 concepts: Mining/Crafting and Questing/Dungeon "Crawling". I strongly suggest that NPCs in towns have randomized quests to do, and maybe even dungeons to do it in. But even without the dungeons, questing gives the player a way to do odd-jobs for money and food, and may even be a part of a line of quests. Food and drink should also be a constant worry for the player (at varying degrees maybe for different difficulties). mining and selling gems, and doing quests should be the main ways players get money for food. If the player has enough land and the right tools, he may start a farm of some kind for food, but this should take at least a little while to create. Bottles could be used to get river water for the drink aspect. Food and drink specifics may also be changed by what race you are.
Mining and crafting should be *almost* as important as it is in minecraft, though the crafting bit would be more for creating gear and potions and RPG stuff. To mine (break) stone and ores, one needs a pickaxe. Not sure about having durability in for equipment, so I'll just say I'm on the fence for that. However, I do think that there should be different levels of pickaxes, and you need stronger ores to make stronger pickaxes to get even stronger ores (like in minecraft). Also, this gives even more choices for the player, since they would have to make the choice between using their more rare ores for a pickaxe to get other better ores, or to stick with your old pickaxe and use that ore for creating any number of other equipment. I hope for at least 8 or 10 different types of metals, some real and some not so real. The very high level ores might be only craftable by master blacksmiths of certain races, and you may need to enlist their help.
5.Experience and Levels, ala Might & Magic
This will be my last section for this post tonight, and it won't be big, considering I just thought of it as I was typing earlier. For what I've read that Paul wants, and looking at what I've suggested, I believe the ideal system for experience and levels would be something similar to Might & Magic 6-8's system (as far as getting new levels, what the levels mean and possibly skill levels and how to get them). If you have never played, seen, or heard of Might & Magic, then look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Might_and_Magic_VI:_The_Mandate_of_Heaven for a small description. The main points I wanted to bring over are to have the abilities either already obtained, or gotten through training by an NPC. Once obtained, you can put points you gain through levels into skills of your choosing. Once the correct amount of points are put into a skill, you may find another NPC who will train you to greater degrees of that skill (expert, master, etc.). Every town should have a trainer, who will allow you to advance to the next level once you have enough experience, for a little bit of coin. This RPG concept alone is simple to understand but hard to master, giving the game even more appeal.

Well thats it for now. If you actually read through all of this, congrats and thanks! The things I've suggested here I truly believe would make the final RPG mode of the game fun and engaging, and the idea of a somewhat never-ending-yet-unique adventure would have players coming from everywhere. Things like mobs, rideable creatures, ore types, and magic essence finding will most likely dominate the next installment.

TTFN! (TaTaForNow!)

haha no, i believe in you Paul. Just expect to start hearing alot from me!

I'm glad you say that, because my brainstorming is purely for your use and benefit, and is only meant as my personal suggestion box, spanning both concepts and features. I just want to try and bring a different perspective to things so you can make the best game it can be. and if my ideas get put in thats only a bonus

This all looks amazing, the races, the weather, the backstory, the magic, the (hopefully emerald green) dragon, it all sounds engaging and lots of fun! keep up the good work Paul! I've been thinking about this game nonstop and i have been toying with many ideas in the direction I hope/wish mythruna is going. I'm going to start brainstorming and soon will start a big post on concepts i'd like in this forum section, i hope i can help in any way.

Waving leaves was one thing i was going to suggest soon. Glad to hear it was already noted!