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Author Topic: The AI is the game...  (Read 33340 times)
pspeed
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« Reply #30 on: December 04, 2012, 10:52:27 PM »

The nice thing is that on multiplayer, the load will be on the server and not the client.  So even if for some reason a computer does not have enough CPU to run physics and AI (and I've done my job very poorly in that case) then it might still be able to connect to a server and play just fine.
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belgariad87
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« Reply #31 on: December 05, 2012, 05:13:12 AM »

The nice thing is that on multiplayer, the load will be on the server and not the client.  So even if for some reason a computer does not have enough CPU to run physics and AI (and I've done my job very poorly in that case) then it might still be able to connect to a server and play just fine.
thats interesting.
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Teknonick
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« Reply #32 on: December 05, 2012, 11:31:56 AM »

by the time mythruna is alpha, my computer will not be able to run mythruna Sad
By the time Mythruna is Alpha, people won't have to worry about 'optimizing' there games. :3
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Sean
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« Reply #33 on: December 05, 2012, 12:56:02 PM »

by the time mythruna is alpha, my computer will not be able to run mythruna Sad
By the time Mythruna is Alpha, people won't have to worry about 'optimizing' there games. :3
"In Soviet Russia..."

...I hope I'll be able to buy alpha by the time it rolls around Smiley
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« Reply #34 on: December 05, 2012, 10:46:22 PM »

by the time mythruna is alpha, my computer will not be able to run mythruna Sad
By the time Mythruna is Alpha, people won't have to worry about 'optimizing' there games. :3
I wish technology advanced that fast. But people are too stubborn.
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danny
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« Reply #35 on: February 12, 2013, 10:36:23 AM »

if you can make an AI like that, why dont other games have such a thorough system?

They kind of do.  GOAP (Goal Oriented Action Planning) is becoming more common.
http://web.media.mit.edu/~jorkin/goap.html

I don't know how strategic I'll be able to make it yet, but I've found it's mostly how the goals are encoded.  I kind of have a loose multi-layer design at this point.  It may be too slow and I'll fall back on more conventional high-level thinking with goap for the tactical level.  But we'll see.

Either way, if an NPC wanted to get into a house (the want already being decided in some way) and one of the actions he has available is "bash down the door" then that will be considered in his tactical planning.

Based on my understanding of GOAP, either actions need to be mapped as relevant to a certain goal by the designer, or the NPC needs to discover the relvancy through testing a success.  For a FPS/TPS like F.E.A.R. this seems manageable because ultimately the actions of every enemy distills down to, kill the player.  So the designers were able to specifically map certain actions to tactical (shoot, move to nearest cover) or objective (attack, vacate compromised position) goals.

I imagine that the list of actions available to an NPC are enormous.  While preconditions can filter the list down, it's still an incredible feat to perform AI planning through a tangled web of destroying the door, finding a key, or even buying the services of a locksmith.  And then all the tactics to accomplish such objectives.

How are you programming the NPCs to negotiate through their available actions?  Are you limiting them to only certain sets of actions per goal?  Or is there a web of action and goal relationships with heuristic values to determine their cost and effectiveness?
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pspeed
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« Reply #36 on: February 12, 2013, 02:30:16 PM »

if you can make an AI like that, why dont other games have such a thorough system?

They kind of do.  GOAP (Goal Oriented Action Planning) is becoming more common.
http://web.media.mit.edu/~jorkin/goap.html

I don't know how strategic I'll be able to make it yet, but I've found it's mostly how the goals are encoded.  I kind of have a loose multi-layer design at this point.  It may be too slow and I'll fall back on more conventional high-level thinking with goap for the tactical level.  But we'll see.

Either way, if an NPC wanted to get into a house (the want already being decided in some way) and one of the actions he has available is "bash down the door" then that will be considered in his tactical planning.

Based on my understanding of GOAP, either actions need to be mapped as relevant to a certain goal by the designer, or the NPC needs to discover the relvancy through testing a success.  For a FPS/TPS like F.E.A.R. this seems manageable because ultimately the actions of every enemy distills down to, kill the player.  So the designers were able to specifically map certain actions to tactical (shoot, move to nearest cover) or objective (attack, vacate compromised position) goals.

I imagine that the list of actions available to an NPC are enormous.  While preconditions can filter the list down, it's still an incredible feat to perform AI planning through a tangled web of destroying the door, finding a key, or even buying the services of a locksmith.  And then all the tactics to accomplish such objectives.

How are you programming the NPCs to negotiate through their available actions?  Are you limiting them to only certain sets of actions per goal?  Or is there a web of action and goal relationships with heuristic values to determine their cost and effectiveness?

Every action has a set of prerequisites and net effects.  If you are looking for a desired effect then you start from all of the actions that can produce that effect... then use their prerequisites to look for actions that are either already satisfied or you look for actions that solve their prerequisites and so on.

It's basically a graph... so traversing it should not be too complicated.  It can also be tuned to never explore back up the chain too far... making the AI dumber but more responsive.  Though I doubt it will be re-evaluating its plan very often anyway.  As far as "dumber creatures" versus "smarter creatures" that will boil down to the actions they have available in the first place.

In any case, I will feel very lucky if NPCs are ever smart enough to hire a locksmith. Smiley
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