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Author Topic: let me know  (Read 47111 times)
theamericono
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« on: July 22, 2013, 03:30:02 PM »

im just interested in computers

so if u guys and girls would ever be so kind and tell my what kinda computer u have  and how it run mythruna ( like fps)  and overall like about the computer (i am looking into building a desketop or buy a desktop or laptop)

that would be great Grin
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Sean
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« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2013, 05:06:35 PM »

Laptop: Acer Aspire 5560G-7809 (You wont be able to buy this anywhere btw)
Processor: Quad core A6-3420M @ 1.6 ghz (2.4 ghz turbo)
Graphics card: AMD Radeon HD 6520G and AMD Radeon HD 7670M in Crossfire
RAM: 8 gigs at 1333mhz

Mythruna gets about 45 FPS


Desktop specs copied from my Xfire profile:
Manufacturer   Hyrule Incorporated
Processor   AMD FX(tm)-8350 Eight-Core Processor (8 CPUs) @ 4.0 GHz
Memory   8192MB Low Profile RAM DDR3 OC'd to 1866 from 1600
Hard Drive   256 GB Vertex 4 SSD w/ 750 GB Backup Drive
Motherboard   GIGABYTE GA-990FXA-UD5 AM3+ AMD 990FX
Operating System   Arch Linux
Video   Video Card   NVIDIA GeForce GTX 560 Ti
Physics Card   No
Monitor   23" HDMI LED-LCD Acer
Sound   Sound Card   Dolby Home Theater
Speakers   Altech HD Speakers (x2 + 1 Bass)
Peripherals   Keyboard   Razer BlackWidow
Mouse   Microsoft Mouse
Mouse Surface   Surface 1030
Computer Case   Sunbeam Acrylic Case w/ 850 watt Power Supply

I don't know the FPS because I always have VSYNC on, so it's at a constant 60 FPS.

Keep in mind Paul hasn't introduced the "laggy stuff" like NPC's, physics, etc. So my laptop that gets ~45 fps might only get 25 fps once these things are implemented.
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theamericono
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« Reply #2 on: July 22, 2013, 06:51:11 PM »

if i where to build my own pc what size tower recommend
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Sean
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« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2013, 07:17:39 PM »

ATX will be more than enough. Just make sure your case has enough room to fit whatever graphics card you decide to buy.
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pspeed
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« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2013, 08:33:02 PM »

And if you can, buy a case without a power supply and then buy a separate Antec power supply or something.  From experience: don't skimp on the power supply.

I have two AMD Phenom Black 6 core machines that I built 2.5 years ago when I started Mythruna development (about $800 each back then with everything but the monitor/keyboard/mouse which I already have bunches of).  I put GTX 460s in both of them.

I get an average of 130-150 FPS or so in Mythruna at 128 clip.
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Michael
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« Reply #5 on: July 22, 2013, 09:00:03 PM »

hey can you two (Sean and Paul) tell me if this is a good $300 - $350 build my friend made? http://pcpartpicker.com/user/spacemyname9749/saved/1MmG
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Sean
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« Reply #6 on: July 22, 2013, 09:11:56 PM »

hey can you two (Sean and Paul) tell me if this is a good $300 - $350 build my friend made? http://pcpartpicker.com/user/spacemyname9749/saved/1MmG
Is this for gaming? I don't recommend this specific APU for gaming. I would go the AM3+ route along with a dedicated card instead of FM2 for upgrade reasons.
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pspeed
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« Reply #7 on: July 22, 2013, 09:39:16 PM »

You have a micro ATX motherboard and an ATX case.  It says it's compatible but you will be happier with a real ATX motherboard instead of the little dinky micro-ATX.  Rule of thumb: spend a little extra on the motherboard because it's the worst thing to have to replace (everything has to come out and back in)... so buy a decent one.  Personally, I'd never buy anything without hardware RAID on it... but I like RAID0 for some systems. Smiley

Ugh... and unless you want your machine to be as slow as a dog, never ever buy a 5400 RPM hard drive.  7200 RPM makes such a huge difference for everything... putting 5400 in is like soaking the whole thing in molasses.  I wouldn't even recommend it for business machines.  Everything about windows just slows down when the hard drive is slow.

Don't skimp on the power supply.  Buy an Antec or something name brand... do the research.

And I agree with Sean re: the embedded graphics.  Unless it's just for surfing the internet and reading e-mail.

Really, if you want to build your own machine as cheap as possible and have it also be decent then you are going to have to be a lot more educated than the average consumer.  I'd recommend spending lots of time on sites like Tom's hardware (http://www.tomshardware.com/) until the trade offs of one approach versus another make some sense.

The education is less critical if money is less of an issue because you can just buy on a specific point in the price curve and trust the market to have settled out properly.  It's not always right but it's usually right enough not to matter.

No one asked but here is my general theory on that...

Most of us don't really buy technically, we rent a position on the price/performance curve.  It looks something like this:



For most things, as the performance increases the price goes up gradually until the point it starts to jump, double, and more.  CPUs are the best example of this as often the top performing CPUs are up to twice or four times the amount of the next lower price point.

Anyway, as time moves on, things higher on the curve most down the curve.  This is inevitable and unending.  The $2000 CPUs of a decade ago are near worthless at this point.

If you buy near the green price point then you get to keep your level on the curve longer and it's often only a little more than the red marker level.

The other thing is that time will wash out bad products down the curve faster (usually) and many things will have different models that span the curve from the red to green markers.  This means that if you can find something at the red level that's been around for a while and there is a model, same brand, same series up near the green level then often it is not only going to keep you on the curve longer but will likely not end up being a lemon.  (Intel graphics cards are almost the exception that proves the rule though the newer ones are much better... intel has brand recognition that keeps crap around longer than it should be.)

A lot of times you can go to sections or pricewatch.com and just imagine how this curve lays out: http://www.pricewatch.com/price/video_cards/brand,evga
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Sean
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« Reply #8 on: July 22, 2013, 10:08:53 PM »

Remember this is a 13 year old kid (probably) that doesn't have alot of money or any way to make money. So getting micro ATX motherboards might not be such a bad idea since their prices are substantially lower. PS Raidmax is an already established brand so I wouldn't worry about buying from them.
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pspeed
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« Reply #9 on: July 22, 2013, 10:20:59 PM »

Remember this is a 13 year old kid (probably) that doesn't have alot of money or any way to make money. So getting micro ATX motherboards might not be such a bad idea since their prices are substantially lower. PS Raidmax is an already established brand so I wouldn't worry about buying from them.

Yeah, it should be fine... though I had trouble getting things to coexist properly on a micro-ATX.  Hopefully they have worked out those issues.  Looking, it is pretty crazy that the micros are cheaper (it used to not be so)... they essentially have the same components, anyway.

Cheap or not, $300 is a lot of money.  I like to present the "higher on the curve" arguments because sometimes $300 is just as much "a lot of money" as $350 or $400 is.  If you earn $20 a month then you are earning money faster than some of this stuff falls off the curve.  Smart application of 25% can mean a machine that feels good for longer than that %25 would buy outright.

That being said, if being down on the curve is no problem then you might be able to do even cheaper...

...still, don't put a 5400 RPM hard drive in. Smiley  You will regret it ever time you hear it churn.
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Sean
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« Reply #10 on: July 22, 2013, 10:35:19 PM »

The last time you used a micro ATX motherboard must have been a while ago because I've never heard of any problems regarding coexisting. I have an ASRock AM3+ micro ATX mobo with an FX-8120, 8 gigs of dual channel RAM, Geforce GT 610, and two hard drives in software RAID 1. All coexisting nicely.  Grin
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« Reply #11 on: July 22, 2013, 11:13:55 PM »

I'll try to source a better one... just quick and dirty.  I haven't done this in a while so it will be kind of fun:

Case, $10 less at $30:
http://www.amazon.com/Thermaltake-Black-VL80001W2Z-Tower-Gaming/dp/B002Q2M8KK/ref=sr_1_6?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1374556935&sr=1-6

Little more on an AM3+ motherboard... but it has an nVidia embedded GPU at $49:
http://www.amazon.com/FX-Socket-GeForce-Motherboard-N68C-GS/dp/B0083B6HEQ/ref=sr_1_5?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1374557323&sr=1-5

AM3+ chip... quad core like the other one and a little faster on spec: $109:
http://www.amazon.com/AMD-Phenom-3-4Ghz-512KB-4000MHZ/dp/B002SRQ214/ref=sr_1_2?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1374557764&sr=1-2

You could go older for less: $96
http://www.amazon.com/AMD-Athlon-640-Processor-ADX640WFGMBOX/dp/B003M7BLOW/ref=amtcd_B002SRQ214_B003M7BLOW

...but see this is kind of what I'm talking about.  That $13 difference is pretty big in performance difference.

Hard drive, 7200 RPM and 250 gig like in your list: $50
http://www.amazon.com/Seagate-Barracuda-3-5-Inch-Internal-ST500DM002/dp/B005CT56R6/ref=sr_1_12?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1374557995&sr=1-12

...click the 250 gig button.
...but 250 gig is nothing.  Here is one place where it pays to play the curve.  For $5 more you can double the space.
...and for $20 over the original you can quadruple to 1 TB.

So $69 for a hard drive.  (Also, your list has a laptop hard drive instead of a desktop hard drive.)

You can save a little money going for a smaller power supply.  A micro-ATX board with no extra graphics card shouldn't draw anywhere near 600 watts.  Name brand 450 watt at $38
http://www.amazon.com/Antec-VP-450-Energy-Certified-Supply/dp/B004IZN3K2/ref=lp_1161760_1_10?ie=UTF8&qid=1374559119&sr=1-10

Of if you don't mind an off-brand (I still consider Raidmax an off-brand because I'm a snob. Smiley), Non-name brand 550 watt at $22
http://www.amazon.com/Logisys-Corp-Bearing-Supply-PS550E12BK/dp/B004MU8VCS/ref=lp_1161760_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1374559119&sr=1-5

I got lazy on RAM selection... $70 for some nice Corsair (<- name brand)
http://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Vengeance-240-Pin-Platforms-CMZ8GX3M2A1600C9/dp/B004CRSM4I/ref=sr_1_1?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1374559372&sr=1-1

But if you back off of the 8 gig thing then you can probably go cheaper anyway but I didn't look.  I get mixed info on whether you can put just one chip in a dual channel configuration.  If so then you could upgrade in stages but you pay more ultimately.  (Note: even if you can put just one in then the memory access will be slower because dual-channel mode won't kick in.)

So, I think my cheapest configuration above is:
case $30
mb $49
chip $96
hd $50
ps $22
ram $70
-----------
$317

...but I would strongly (emphatically) suggest the larger hard drive, so:

case $30
mb $49
chip $96
hd $69
ps $22
ram $70
---------
$336

Consider a chip upgrade for another $13.

And note: there was no optical drive in the system but I presume you can scavenge one from a donor system. Smiley

Someone can feel free to point out any compatibility issues that I may have missed.  I only researched a little where it wasn't clear.
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pspeed
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« Reply #12 on: July 22, 2013, 11:15:31 PM »

The last time you used a micro ATX motherboard must have been a while ago because I've never heard of any problems regarding coexisting. I have an ASRock AM3+ micro ATX mobo with an FX-8120, 8 gigs of dual channel RAM, Geforce GT 610, and two hard drives in software RAID 1. All coexisting nicely.  Grin

It wasn't even a case problem but I guess the board wasn't properly designed for real graphics cards as it I remember it hitting the ram chips.  It never sat properly in the slot.  The tiny case was a mess, too, but fortunately this spec list was using an ATX case.
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BigredRm
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« Reply #13 on: July 23, 2013, 04:21:13 AM »

Remember this is a 13 year old kid (probably) that doesn't have alot of money or any way to make money. So getting micro ATX motherboards might not be such a bad idea since their prices are substantially lower. PS Raidmax is an already established brand so I wouldn't worry about buying from them.
Those yard are not going to mow themselves.
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Michael
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« Reply #14 on: July 23, 2013, 04:30:13 AM »

Remember this is a 13 year old kid (probably) that doesn't have alot of money or any way to make money. So getting micro ATX motherboards might not be such a bad idea since their prices are substantially lower. PS Raidmax is an already established brand so I wouldn't worry about buying from them.
Those yard are not going to mow themselves.
My grandma said she would pay me $40 to mow the lawn every other week.. we all know that's not happening.. (its a small yard).

PS: Back on topic?
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